Posted By Marc Lynch
Thursday, July 23, 2009 - 6:13 PM
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Me and detained MB blogger AbdelRahman Ayyesh in Cairo, October 2007
I learned yesterday that three leading young Muslim Brotherhood bloggers , including AbdelRahman Ayyesh (pictured above), Ahmed Abu Khalil and Magdi Sa'ad, had been arrested at the Cairo airport and then transferred to state security facilities. Ayyesh and Saad were both important parts of the youth MB bloggers movement which was pushing the organization towards greater internal transparency and more moderate, politically engaged positions within Egyptian politics. Their detention is deeply troubling... but all too typical of the recent trends in an Egyptian regime consumed by questions about the transition of power from Hosni Mubarak and by its largely failed efforts to broker a Palestinian national unity government.
The detention of the three MB bloggers is part of a wider crackdown which has directly targeted the most moderate and pragmatic figures within the Egyptian Muslim Brotherhood. That ongoing policy escalated dramatically with the arrest of several members of the MB's Guidance Council. The arrested figures including Abdel Monem Abou al-Fattouh, a leading moderate and pragmatic figure within the Egyptian MB, on what appear to be trumped up charges related to his alleged activities with the Global Muslim Brotherhood Organization (about which I'm planning to write a longer piece soon). Abou el-Fattouh remains in prison, where his health is reportedly deteriorating.
This crackdown on the moderate elements of the Egyptian Muslim Brotherhood almost seems calculated to demoralize reformists and drive the MB towards more radical positions. Amr Choukbi, a leading Egyptian analyst of Islamist movements, notes today that Abou el-Fattouh -- a true pragmatist and reformist -- faces a difficult position attempting to open up a largely conservative and closed MB organization, which is made even worse by such political crackdowns against the advocates of political moderation. Khalil el-Anani, another leading Egyptian analyst of Islamist movements, wrote an article the other day laying out the potential consequences:
Firstly, the stepped up crackdown on the Muslim Brotherhood could increase the polarization within the Egyptian scene, which is already boiling over other many political, economic and social factors.
Secondly, the political and religious isolation of the Muslim Brotherhood could contribute to the emergence of either more superficial or stricter religious discourse.
Thirdly, the increased suppression of the Muslim Brotherhood could force some of the group’s grassroots to turn on their leaders and stage violent protests or call for civil disobedience.
It would be no exaggeration to say that the arrest of the group’s leading reformers, led by Abdel Moneim Aboul Fotouh, is tantamount to the execution of Sayyid Qutb in mid 1960s of the last century and its far-reaching repercussions on the Muslim Brotherhood’s young generation and the other young religious enthusiasts at the time.
It is enough to look at the Muslim Brotherhood discussion boards and blogs to find out the extent of resentment and tension among the Brotherhood grassroots after the arrest of Aboul Fotouh, and their appeals to the group’s leaders to move and to take firm positions against the regime.
Fourth, the arrest of the group’s reformists and moderates could throw the group into intolerance and conservatism. This could benefit the regime temporarily, but it could adversely affect the society on the long run.
Fifth, the isolation of the Muslim Brotherhood could contribute to the emergence of radical religious movements seeking to fill the religious and political gap between the state and the society.
Is that what the Egyptian government wants? Does that serve American foreign policy interests? Or would such interests be better served by the evolution of a more moderate, pragmatic and reformist Muslim Brotherhood participating in the political system? Perhaps such matters would make for a useful topic of conversation during Hosni Mubarak's reported August visit to Washington DC.
"moderate Islamists"
Is that public diplomacy, or humor?
Is somebody who embraces an extreme ideology but is less extreme than their compatriots not an extremist? Maybe we should explore this further and talk about moderate totalitarians, since Islamism is totalitarian in nature?
You're probably confused because you equated Islamism with extremism, and therefore labled all Islamists as extremists, which reflects a lack of understanding of nature of Islamic movements and their different ideologies.
Maybe you are right. Maybe I don't understand how a totalitarian ideology such as Islamism can be moderate. Or maybe the problem is that you and Marc Lynch are fans of totalitarian ideologies. Or maybe you are just so ignorant that you don't even know what the word "totalitarian" means, though Marc surely does which leaves me still wondering why he is describing Islamists as "moderate" when he knows very well that isn't so.
Is it humor, Marc? I'm guessing "Public Diplomacy", since that is your field.
I just checked these three blogs, and it seems the three of them stopped blogging during the Gaza war last winter. At about the same time. Two of them are in Arabic. Your friend Abdel Rahman's is in English though. This is his last post:
"Israel massacre civilians in Gaza market (HERE)
A must see video of Israeli war crimes in Gaza. Tens of kids and women were killed for no reason by terrorist Israeli air strike.
THIS IS ISRAEL .. THESE ARE OUR CHILDREN"
That is dated Sunday, January 4, 2009.
That's a pretty inflammatory post for a Egyptian Muslim Brotherhood member to have been making at that point in time, wouldn't you agree Marc? And are those the words of a moderate? Seriously? That is your HONEST opinion, when you take your "Public Diplomacy" hat off? Would you call an American who was running off at the mouth with that kind of garbage directed towards Arabs a moderate?
And since they were arrested more than 6 months after they last blogged, is there any chance they weren't arrested because they were bloggers, but rather were arrested for something else they were involved in? Is being a "blogger" an automatic get-out-of-jail-free card now? What if Osama bin Ladin starts a blog? Should we stop hunting him?
PS- did you see your commenter talking about "avenging" this? He doesn't want justice. he wants revenge. Is he a moderate, too? :o
"craig"
When you resort to personal attacks, you suppress the appetite for a rational dialogue. Although you raised some valid points, but unfortunately I see no point of continuing this debate, because you seem only willing to listen to the echo of your voice yelling… in a vacuum
The vacuum existed long before I got to this blog, or encountered you, Mansour. The blog caters to Arab nationalists and Islamists, by design, and it always has. I think that is Marc's version of public diplomacy. I assure you, I have no more desire to discuss these things with you or anyone like you than you do with me. You seem like a space alien from mars, to me. There's nothing to say. I fail to understand what Marc hopes to achieve by promoting alternate realities.
I see no point of continuing this debate
Main reason being, there is no debate. It isn't possible to describe somebody who wants their nation to be under the complete control of religious clergy as a "moderate". That's as extreme as religion gets.
Now, if the point of discussion was Arab nationalism, it'd be a different story. It is possible for somebody to want Arab unity, even across borders, and still be a moderate.
But that wasn't what Marc was blogging about.
I am terribly saddened by the distressing news concerning young Mr. Ayyesh and I hope this outrage will be avenged some day.
I am not really impressed by this whole bloggers' impending revolution coming to Egypt. I also doubt the importance of the so called "MB bloggers" in reforming the MB. They have limited audience, if any. Leaders like Abu el Fotoh and el Erian are the real center of gravity in the process of reforming the MB, not the bloggers. Certainly, these bloggers deserve support and solidarity, but I would be careful of using terms such as "most infuential" or "leading" MB bloggers, in absence of any real indicator of their political weight.
"Leaders like Abu el Fotoh and el Erian are the real center of gravity in the process of reforming the MB"
You can't reform a totalitarian ideology. That's why it is called totalitarian.
Did you look up the word "totalitarian" yet? If you haven't yet, don't bother. This is a pretty good definition of it here:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Muslim_Brotherhood
The Brotherhood's stated goal is to instill the Qur'an and Sunnah as the "sole reference point for ... ordering the life of the Muslim family, individual, community ... and state".
Now, can you tell me exactly how one would "reform" that? In which ways, specifically, would the Muslim Brotherhood relinquish total control of the state and everyone and everything in it? Details, please. I'm dying to hear them :)
Firstly, the stepped up crackdown on the Muslim Brotherhood could increase the polarization within the Egyptian scene, which is already boiling over other many political, economic and social factors.
I think it's actually "boiling over" because of the Muslim Brotherhood's activities of the last several decades. I can see why he would go with the old "if you try to stop us it will just get worse for you" routine, though. It's a sure winner. Especially when talking to Westerners. And it may even be true. I kinda like the way he implied it wouldn't be the MB that caused the trouble if the crackdowns continued but rather some other mysterious powers, such as Al Qaida or monkeys flying out of my ass, though.
Secondly, the political and religious isolation of the Muslim Brotherhood could contribute to the emergence of either more superficial or stricter religious discourse.
Well... actually... there kinda isn't any stricter religious discourse. Unless we count Al Qaida. But isn't Al Qaida an offshoot of the Muslim Brotherhood? Or do we not mention such things these days? OK, stricter religious discourse it is! And that's bad! Really bad!
Thirdly, the increased suppression of the Muslim Brotherhood could force some of the group’s grassroots to turn on their leaders and stage violent protests or call for civil disobedience.
Yes, it's the monkey's flying out of asses that nobody has any control over that will cause trouble, not the leadership of the MB.
Didn't he already say that? He loses points for being redundant, right? Or does he gain points that way, since he's an Islamist?
It would be no exaggeration to say that the arrest of the group’s leading reformers, led by Abdel Moneim Aboul Fotouh, is tantamount to the execution of Sayyid Qutb in mid 1960s of the last century and its far-reaching repercussions on the Muslim Brotherhood’s young generation and the other young religious enthusiasts at the time.
That's three times, Marc. Three times he went with the same spiel, using minor wording variations. What does that mean in the realm of Public Diplomacy? Surely it must tell us something, besides the guy is boring and lacks creativity? This is how they brainwash people, right? Just say the same old sh^& over and over again until people get so tired of hearing it that their faces go blank and the drool starts dribbling out of the corners of their mouths?
It is enough to look at the Muslim Brotherhood discussion boards and blogs to find out the extent of resentment and tension among the Brotherhood grassroots after the arrest of Aboul Fotouh, and their appeals to the group’s leaders to move and to take firm positions against the regime.
*sigh* Four effing times. And you wonder why nobody reads this crap?
Fourth, the arrest of the group’s reformists and moderates could throw the group into intolerance and conservatism. This could benefit the regime temporarily, but it could adversely affect the society on the long run.
Islamists who are intolerant and conservative? Wouldn't want that to happen! That could adversely affect society! The current levels of intolerance and conservatism amongst Islamists are just about right for society, presumably.
Fifth, the isolation of the Muslim Brotherhood could contribute to the emergence of radical religious movements seeking to fill the religious and political gap between the state and the society.
What kind of religious group would the Muslim Brotherhood consider "radical"? Damn... we're back on "it's us or Al Qaida and the monkeys that fly out of my ass" again.
Marc,
Is that what the Egyptian government wants? Does that serve American foreign policy interests? Or would such interests be better served by the evolution of a more moderate, pragmatic and reformist Muslim Brotherhood participating in the political system? Perhaps such matters would make for a useful topic of conversation during Hosni Mubarak's reported August visit to Washington DC.
Why don't you explain to everyone why you believe it is in American interests to support a radical Islamist group in Egypt, instead of posing rhetorical questions? Even somebody with ADD could spend 10 minutes Googling "Muslim Brotherhood" and see that America should want no part of that. Tell us why it isn't so, because when you try to paint a happy face on these clowns you come across like Jimmy Carter when he was playing kissy face with Khomeini.
What does he mean by "conservativism"?
They are going to obey the ruler, follow a madhab, join a tariqqa, and subscribe to the creed of Abu al-Hasan al-Ash'ari or Abu Mansur Al Maturidi?
Since when did the neo-Kharajite strands of Ikhawni Islamism become synonymous with Islamic Conservativism?!
Hello I would like to invite you to visit our website : http://www.ikhwanweb.com/
IKhwanweb is the Muslim Brotherhood"s only official English web site. The Main office is located in London, although Ikhwanweb has correspondents in most countries. Our staff is exclusively made of volunteers and stretched over the five continents.
The Muslim Brotherhood opinions and views can be found under the sections of MB statements and MB opinions, in addition to the Editorial Message.
Items posted under "other views" are usually different from these of the Muslim Brotherhood.
Ikhwanweb does not censor any articles or comments but has the right only to remove any inappropriate words that defy public taste
Ikhwanweb is not a news website, although we report news that matter to the Muslim Brotherhood"s cause. Our main misson is to present the Muslim Brotherhood vision right from the source and rebut misonceptions about the movement in western societies. We value debate on the issues and we welcome constructive criticism.
to help inform you about your subject matter,questions
If you have any addition questions you can email us at :
omarmorsy51@yahoo.com
Marc Lynch is associate professor of political science and international affairs at George Washington University.
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